Curse

Sifow Chan · Jun 14, 2007, 09:43 PM // 21:43

The Paragon's keep getting nerfs..they are hard enough to play against the other classes. I love paragons and I can't stand seeing them get worse and worse everytime the devs do profession updates :/. Everyone complains about the Necro soul reaping nerfs but what about the little paragons :'( they need some love too...

clawofcrimson · Jun 14, 2007, 10:02 PM // 22:02

the paragon didn't really get a nerf hit this time... aside from defensive anthem... which really needed the nerf if you look at recent tournies.

...but I understand your frustration.. the class was poorly implemented... and as a result has been receiving toning down since conception.

Series · Jun 14, 2007, 10:07 PM // 22:07

I still love paragons. One day hopefully Anet figures out to fix them! Great idea for a profession, poor implementation.

Onarik Amrak · Jun 14, 2007, 11:38 PM // 23:38

Agreed... but at least Defensive Anthem is still usable. It was my usual elite in PvE cause most of the others are well... *sigh*

Series · Jun 15, 2007, 02:24 AM // 02:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Onarik Amrak

Agreed... but at least Defensive Anthem is still usable. It was my usual elite in PvE cause most of the others are well... *sigh*

The paragon elites I usually roll:

Crippling Anthem (PvP only)

Angelic Bond

Defensive Anthem

Focused Anger

It's Just a Flesh Wound

Song of Purification

Song of Restoration

Cruel Spear

Stunning Strike (PvP only)

Cautery Sig

Plenty of decent Paragon elites IMO. But that is the problem... I use the term decent literally. They aren't really anything special, but can be used in the right builds.

bhavv · Jun 15, 2007, 02:30 AM // 02:30

One of the 'Never' shouts got buffed (i cant remember which is which from the names

) 15 seconds of regen for party members near death or suffering degen for 5 energy is quite nice.

I never used defensive anthem anyway. Although I cant use watch yourself + stand your ground on morgahn anymore

Keero89 · Jun 15, 2007, 02:49 AM // 02:49

I have nothing worthy to add to the thread, so I will just say this:

When I first saw the thread title, I instantly thought "You have 80AL, you can handle it, wimp." /unworthy

klrk · Jun 15, 2007, 03:07 AM // 03:07

the pain part for paragon is the armor skill cap

Miral · Jun 15, 2007, 03:07 AM // 03:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by clawofcrimson

the paragon didn't really get a nerf hit this time... aside from defensive anthem... which really needed the nerf if you look at recent tournies.

heh and if you look at all other forms of play, defensive anthem is already underwhelming... a weaker conditional elite version of the non-elite aegis...

Age · Jun 15, 2007, 04:11 AM // 04:11

They did it to them selves they deserve it as to the other non Paragon skills they got nerfed take WatchYouself for example.They used that to keep their chants up.They got what they deserved.

Miral · Jun 15, 2007, 04:17 AM // 04:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

They did it to them selves they deserve it as to the other non Paragon skills they got nerfed take WatchYouself for example.They used that to keep their chants up.They got what they deserved.

you do realize not every paragon plays tournaments right? and even that not every paragon in tournaments uses abusive builds? why don't we just say pvp paragons abused builds, so all of pvp should be nerfed to uselessness, they deserve it. right?

Age · Jun 15, 2007, 04:23 AM // 04:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miral

you do realize not every paragon plays tournaments right? and even that not every paragon in tournaments uses abusive builds? why don't we just say pvp paragons abused builds, so all of pvp should be nerfed to uselessness, they deserve it. right?

It doesn't exactly work that way now does it.They are still fine for pve even if they get hit again.You go tell those player abusing the Paragon's in tournaments that.

Miral · Jun 15, 2007, 04:33 AM // 04:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

It doesn't exactly work that way now does it.They are still fine for pve even if they get hit again.You go tell those player abusing the Paragon's in tournaments that.

a lot of the paragon nerfs have hurt pve paragons drastically. especially the ones that nerfed ally-skills to be party member only, those were a real asset of paragons in missions where you have to guard NPCs.
and I seriously doubt pvp abusers care who they hurt. its up to anet to either take administrative action or find a better way to fix pvp without hurting pve. the only thing that will completely stop abuse in pvp is to either ban the abusers, or remove pvp. or make it so only candycane weapons and rez sig work in pvp

but nerfing the skills does nothing but hurt pve paragons and have the pvp abusers just move on to a different gimmick.

Kale Ironfist · Jun 15, 2007, 04:55 AM // 04:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miral

a weaker conditional elite version of the non-elite aegis

Not entirely. The fact that it can't be stripped is worth the elite slot and conditionality. Why else is Aegis chain so popular?

Tadpole Lord · Jun 15, 2007, 05:11 AM // 05:11

Yeah, pretty much paragons have been nerfed to death when they were mediocre to begin with. My groups in pve never take paragons anymore, they are simply unneccessary in every single way. They are even more useless in pvp, so way to go Anet. Way to go...

Marth Reynolds · Jun 15, 2007, 05:18 AM // 05:18

Interuptable chants will hurt the paras as well i think.
and they even upped defensive anthems cast time, is this screaming for interupt me or what?

I stopped playing paragons a while ago, they are quite decent but had to many nerfs, altough for team running builds i'l still want to add a para before warrior.

hopefulliness · Jun 15, 2007, 06:23 AM // 06:23

Personally, my paragon is lying on the floor bleeding from all the nerf bat hits

. He has been hit by the command attribute nerf and now the armor cap nerf... so now i guess i will just ignore the command attribute

Miral · Jun 15, 2007, 06:55 AM // 06:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kale Ironfist

Not entirely. The fact that it can't be stripped is worth the elite slot and conditionality. Why else is Aegis chain so popular?

not being stripped is a good counterbalance for the condition of not using attack skills, but its still severely weak for an elite... well, really, almost all paragon elites are... the only ones that seem to see a lot of use in PvE are cautery signet and focused anger, and the latter is just to fuel GftE...

Sol Deathgard · Jun 15, 2007, 07:04 AM // 07:04

When NF 1st came out a couple of guildies of mine made paragons & loved them, they played until 3 am with them cause they thought that Paragons where so fun, but over the course of all the nerfs that came, they've used their paragons less and less, and one of them said the other day that even though she loves her paragon, she will be collecting dust now because she is absolutly worthless now simply because a few people in pvp figured out a good build and a few other cry babies couldn't figure out counters and cried for nerfs every single month. Once again it's a case of people that can't read their damn skills and make build that counter stuff ruining the game for the rest of us. So for everyone that comes to sites like this begging anet to nerf 1 skill or build because you are too stuipd to figure out how to beat it, F you.

Kale Ironfist · Jun 15, 2007, 07:24 AM // 07:24

There is something wrong when all the counters to Paragons are not worth bringing into a team, because that's all they shut down. So anyone who says to learn to adapt, perhaps YOU should learn that having counters doesn't mean that it's balanced.